My V Tail design and build.

[guest325]

At last I';ve got round to the scratch build that I';ve been promising myself to do for the past 4 months, it may well have been a Tricopter but I just couldn';t come up with a design for the Yaw mechanism I was 100% % happy with so when I saw what Matt has come up with at Simple copter my mind was made up - it has to be a V tail.
I';ve got all of the bits together now including my own design tail motor mounts that will be fixed rather differently than most do them plus it';s going to have a single long front arm assembly like a T copter. All I need to do now is look at the plate layout to give me the best options for getting the weight distribution right.
The frame will cost me the princely sum of £1.75, I have not added up the cost of the rest of the bits yet - might frighten me  ::)
Anyway I shall post progress as soon as I get things moving. Just for a taster here is the bits:

[Biffa]

The motor mounts look very professional and shiny

[guest325]

The motor mounts look very professional and shiny

Thanks, they are made from 430 BA stainless steel, only 0.9mm thick but plenty strong enough for this.
I';m going to mount the motors on small 70 shore rubber grommets, that';s why I';m using the cross mounts, hold them on with nyloc nuts and gradually tighten them up - I';m expecting this to soak up some of the vibrations that you always get (unless you are absolutely scrupulous about balancing). It';s something that if it works ok I shall transfer the method to my other stuff possibly including my planes.

[JT]

 Just needs banging together now!    

What are the arms salvaged from?   

I too was so impressed with the recent  videos from simple copter and flitetest that I have ordered a few bits from Hobbyking to make a v tail, including a kk2......  I just don';t know whether to make a T design or a Y based one, so I will be watching with great interest   The thought of something with quad four motor grunt with tricopter like yaw appeals!

[guest325]

Just needs banging together now!    

What are the arms salvaged from?   

I too was so impressed with the recent  videos from simple copter and flitetest that I have ordered a few bits from Hobbyking to make a v tail, including a kk2......  I just don';t know whether to make a T design or a Y based one, so I will be watching with great interest   The thought of something with quad four motor grunt with tricopter like yaw appeals!

The arms are from the whirlypole clothes drier her indoors was going to give to the scrapman over the weekend, ideal 16mm x 1mm thick plus it';s not soft aluminum it';s age hardened so nice and springy.
Matt from Simplecopter does my head in the way he flies especially when you know it';s a simple KK2 FC he uses, amazing skills.

[guest325]

The design side is now complete apart from where all the wiring is going, if anyone wants an editable file of my design just ask and I will send you one - you may want to improve on what I';ve done!

[Biffa]

Looking forward to seeing the build come together

[barneyg]

I really need to dust off my design skills again ... last time I did any of note I was at Uni.

I really like what you';ve done ... I';ve been thinking about that hunter design on the rcgroups forums ... I like the 400 size better - stiffer arms, but it only takes 8 inch props due to ground clearance at the back.  This means you need about 1500 kv motors to give it a decent turn of speed.  I was thinking that if you took the spar that went from the main body piece and the tail V and angled it up at say 45 degrees (angle would need to be calculated) before levelling it back out for the tail section you might be able to get 10 inch props on it.

[guest325]

My props are not going underneath, having researched it I found there was no real advantage either way so I have opted for props on top, it will mean that my 1100kV motors with 9x4.7 or maybe 10x4.7 on 3S should give me good performance.
When you look at it you would think that pointing the motors towards each other would give rise to disruptive air flow but it seems that it most likely results in better lift because of the combined lift, possibly at the expense of reduced yaw capability but that remains to be seen.

[guest325]

This gives you a better idea of what the Airframe will look like - not had time to model the rest of the bits yet - priorities first - The airframe!!!

[guest325]

Just done a bit more showing where 10" props will spin - looking just how I want it to be!!!

[guest325]

Quick update, here';s what the frame really looks like:
Weighed all of the bits complete with a 3S 2200 zippy compact - marginally over 1kg, with 800 watts on tap on 3S or 1200 on 4S it will be fun!!!

[guest325]

At long last another update, decorating done so time for me to get some work done on this project.
Had a dry fit of most of the bits tonight, sorted out my fixing methods and rough layout for the electrics.
Pics of how I am fitting it together:
Cable ties, double sided foam pads are used in the main but I have used self tapping screws through the rear motor mounts to maintain the angle accurately.

[guest325]

So, after the mishap with the KK2/Tarot 450 mix I';ve decided to do what I originally intended to do. Tarot distribution board for VTail and arms for spares!
Done a lot of fettling to get what I want, bottom part (power distribution and electrics layout) now complete; top part to do.
The battery is underslung between the skids, skids may not be tall enough but I won';t know until I try it.
Plywood bits varnished ready for colour coating of some sort or other, hopefully it will be finished and ready for maiden by the weekend.

[guest325]

Woohoooo, she flies!!!!
My legs were like rubber but it had to be done  ::)  ::) 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wp6F8Zz9lOk&feature=youtube_gdata_player
Next is to explore what she will do!

[Biffa]

Looks great Darrell

It';s a good buzz when a scratch build takes off for the first time.

[guest325]

Yeah, it was amazing! Default settings apart from the rates on the rear motors down to 100 instead of 120 because I';m using the same size props front/rear. There';s a long way to go before I shall be happy with it but so far so good, I want to see how it will behave with my keyfob cam on board, I';ve tried to isolate things as best I can - all mounts are double sided foam tape and cable ties so with a bit of luck the jello problems shouldn';t rear their ugly head!

[teslahed]

That did look very good for a first flight - I';d be pleased.

[guest325]

Thanks Chris that';s a very welcome comment especially coming from you!
I think that I';m nearly there but will have a better idea when I';ve fixed it together properly - it was only held together last night by double sided tape (albeit very good stuff).

[teslahed]

I wonder if you left the double sided foam sticky tape in place and drilled through and used nuts and bolts as well - would the tape act as vibration dampening within the frame and improve things? Or would it make the frame less stiff and fly less well? That might depend on the thickness of the foam and tightness of the bolts. Just a thought.

In the long run i might be tempted to replace that bottom plate you';ve got on the inside with a lighter power distribution board to save a bit of weight - that';s not terribly important though.


http://quadcopters.co.uk/power-distribution-board-369-p.asp

[guest325]

I am going to leave the tape there, the last time I took it apart I actually broke the plywood top deck trying to unstick it! The foam is only 0.5mm thick and is fairly resilient (it';s one I got from Aldi - Workzone brand), I am going to hold it all together with Cable ties, I';ve pocketed the top/bottom plates out to suit the cable ties I';m using - it';s quite a rigid assembly when fixed together, I honestly think that tape is so good the cable ties wont be doing much!
I had thought about using one of the power distribution boards like the one you';ve suggested maybe at a later date. I think in this case making it lighter may end up with it being less stable, it could be that the weight it is is damping things down AUW is just under 1 kilo including battery (3S 2200 Zippy compact), so to some V Tails it is a bit of a porker!
What I';m trying to do with it is to make it into a camera ship, I';m trying my 808#16 keyfob cam first and if all goes well might invest in the Mobius. At the moment I';m not seriously interested in FPV but that may well change.
Thanks for your comments it is appreciated!

[JT]

  Been looking forward to seeing this finished!  Looks really good in the video Darrell

So much more satisfaction from seeing something you made rather than bought fly. ::)

[guest325]

Just done a bit of tidying up, I';ve now got it to the stage where I can give it a proper evaluation. If all goes well I intend to use it as a pattern for what I really think would be good.
I want to use g/f plate for the the top/bottom plates and square c/f tube for the arms possibly using wood dowel inside the arms for reinforcement, apart from that I would possibly use nylon nuts & screws for fixings instead of cable ties. Here';s some info on wood reinforced carbon arms, interesting!
http://www.flitetest.com/articles/carbon-hybrid-booms-here-s-how-to-make-your-own

[Gav]

Looks really good.  Nice one

[jimbo385]

Darrell,

That looks really cool! 

What props are you using? The reason I ask is that a frien has built a vtail quad with the tail motors underneath. He has 1 clockwise and 3 counter (or the other way round!) props and it flies really well!

Cheers.

[guest325]

Darrell,

That looks really cool! 

What props are you using? The reason I ask is that a frien has built a vtail quad with the tail motors underneath. He has 1 clockwise and 3 counter (or the other way round!) props and it flies really well!

Cheers.

Thanks, I am really pleased with it - I have the conventional layout of R';s on front left & rear right and normal rotation front right and rear left.
At the moment I';ve got 8 x 4.7 all round but will be going to 9 x4.7 when I';ve had chance to fly it a bit; I want it to be not too aggressive until I';ve got the hang of it!

[nub]

aye get those front motors bolted onto the arms

looks and flies alright, well done.

[guest325]

Now that I';ve finished putting it together properly I thought I would have a go in acro mode, so tonight as soon as I got home I had to have a go;  omg it';s so different good job I';d got brown trousers on  what a transformation - I can see me using a bit of expo on this despite my dislike of it!!!

[Biffa]

Yup, they are a totally different beast in acro. Wait until you up the stick scaling

[guest325]

Yup, they are a totally different beast in acro. Wait until you up the stick scaling

I think that is a very long way off! It reminds me a bit of the first flight I had with my Crack Yak,  full rates and had never piloted a 3D foamy before  it scared me sh1tless!
This is how you do it if you';ve got no fear!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cLgbwBRVdZU&feature=youtube_gdata_player