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Author Topic: And so it begins  (Read 256 times)

Offline mo_miah

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And so it begins
« on: January 07, 2019, 22:38:09 »
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46787730

New rules come into place in November
The 5km rule around airports means my local fields are gone as Sywell (tiny local airstrip) is nearby

Online ched999uk

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Re: And so it begins
« Reply #1 on: January 07, 2019, 23:24:28 »
I seem to remember that before they changed the rules it used to be 3km from airport. They reduced it to 1km for some stupid reason. Now we are back to 5km  :angry:
BBC article didn't see to mention when 5km is active or even if it applied to all 'drones' or just over 250gms?
I guess it's all.
Anyone know the regs for kites? Only reason I ask is that within 1km of Blackpool Airport there is a kite surfing school. Can't imagine one of these 'kites' escaping and getting caught up in props/engine within 100m of the end of the runway having a happy outcome!!!!

They even admit that new laws wouldn't have stopped Gatwick fiasco! So what is the point of the regulation????? Stupid and just so politicians can say we did something...... Why do this if you have the technology to protect airports in first place? Then again they should have had the tech installed months or even years ago. They have publicised the risks of a drone strike (even though the research was fixed) so why not have any counter measures???
Once again poor management not only from gov but from airports. They know how much this could have cost them and now Gatwick paid the price of a massive shut down..

Sorry for the rant.......

Offline nate80

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Re: And so it begins
« Reply #2 on: January 08, 2019, 01:16:18 »
Somewhat frustrating, though not surprising.  We all know that registration and an increasingly negative public opinion caused by media bull just causes more grief for the law abiding drone users out there whilst doing very little to dissuade numptys and crims from flying like tits.

It certainly won’t stop me flying, but it may encourage me to take out insurance. My opinion is drone insurance is often not worth the paper it’s printed on, but at least you can couple it with the reg document and wave it in the faces of the anti-drone brigade that is sure to grow in numbers due to our shameful news agencies and political eejits.

Offline aburn09

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Re: And so it begins
« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2019, 02:28:00 »
Interesting how this will be policed......For example I fly freestyle quads on private land however it's surrounded by houses if someone objects to me flying near their boundry do they phone the Police and get a rapid response team turn up as I'm easier to apprehend than a real criminal to boost their arrest figures ?
I have bmfa insurance so am I going to need a licence on top  of that for my 5 inch quads.......I have future proofed myself by building a couple of two inch quads so worse case scenario they are well under the 250 gram so I can still fly those......But what about my helicopter is that going to be classed as a drone ??
So many unanswered questions which will lead to different interpretations by the Police as to whether to prosecute or not ?
On a side note if you have dog walkers who object to you flying as that's probably going to be the main confrontation you have just ask them if they have their dogs micro chipped as that's the law now if they say yes ask for proof which will quiet them down as they are unlikely to have proof on them any more than you have proof you have registered your 'drone'.
I also object to the word drone as I see it as an unmaned aircraft flying miles from the pilot using GPS which unless you own a DJI product which most of us probably don't, we are quadcopter freestylers or racers who keep our quads fairly close by so not drone pilots but again it will be open to interpretation !!
« Last Edit: January 08, 2019, 07:45:37 by aburn09 »

Offline Bad Raven

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Re: And so it begins
« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2019, 06:59:42 »
For the purposes of legislation it has long been stated that ALL UAV are "drones".

I will copy what I posted elsewhere, and yes, part copies other posts above.....................

Chris Grayling made a statement to house yesterday (7th) with regards amended new Drone Laws.  (The house appeared near empty at the time).

Newspapers are reporting, here is one example:-




Most significant comment in this piece (which to the reporters credit does mention twice the uncertainty as to what actually affected Gatwick) is the statement that the “No Fly” zone will now extend to “around 5k” from an airport, where it was 1k.

There was of course no detail, and interestingly no start date mentioned.

One paper is stating that “The exclusion zone around airports will be extended to approximately a 5km-radius (3.1-miles), with additional extensions from runway ends”.

Then after further search I found this:-

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new-police-powers-to-tackle-illegal-use-of-drones

which contains this linked official pathetic woolly video:-




It seems the start date is as per previous stated intent, November 30th 2019.

The other significant mention is the power for the Police to search premises and seize, though the qualification is “where a serious offence has been committed and a warrant is secured”.  So not seemingly “at will” and actually surely no different to now?

Don’t forget that ALL UAV are “drones” for the purposes of this legislation.

There is no mention I can find as yet with regard the significant number of flying sites from which UAV are currently operated that are within ATC zone and so operate with existing (and in one of my club's situation long standing) ATC permission. Obviously with the no-fly zone extending, some flying sites will now fall within that did not before.


ADDITION:-  Note that the official video announcement is so poor they could not even get the title right - "aircrafts"   :banghead:

« Last Edit: January 08, 2019, 07:03:37 by Bad Raven »

Offline hoverfly

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Re: And so it begins
« Reply #5 on: January 08, 2019, 08:54:48 »
Looks like it's a case of "bend over, brace yourself" :angry:
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Offline UrbanFPV

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Re: And so it begins
« Reply #6 on: January 08, 2019, 09:03:45 »

The other significant mention is the power for the Police to search premises and seize, though the qualification is “where a serious offence has been committed and a warrant is secured”.  So not seemingly “at will” and actually surely no different to now?


I don't understand the need for this.  Police have already proved innocent people can be arrested, their homes ransacked and lives destroyed simply for posting a picture of an RC heli on a facebook group - without any need extra legislation.  What's the change.  The police always need a warrant to search your home.

What concerns me more is that an FPN that may be issued in an adhoc manner because some random person is irritated by a drone flying perfectly legally near by.

And if you want examples of how police already abuse their powers against photographers (and others), watch the Crimebodge youtube channel:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCUSL8poMxM_uXWzWExJaY-w

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Offline Bajadre

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Re: And so it begins
« Reply #7 on: January 08, 2019, 12:33:33 »
banging those £100 fines out in no time i bet haha bless um if they cant find someone flying a drone at a internatiomal airport then i feel quite safe flying where i do lol  :beer2:
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Offline Bad Raven

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Re: And so it begins
« Reply #8 on: January 08, 2019, 13:16:17 »
if they cant find someone flying a drone at a international airport then i feel quite safe flying where i do

What drone?

An old rhyme:-

Last night upon the stair
I met a man who wasn't there
He wasn't there again today
Oh HOW I wish he'd go away

My club has been operating for more than forty years within 2k of an airport ( not aligned to runway, limited to 400' and done with all due permissions inc posting in NOTAMs.)  NO incidents or issues AT ALL, none, nil, nix, zada, f'all.

What happens now we wait and see if local ATC can determine or if this is fixed country wide. Sad times.

Offline tipsy trucker

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Re: And so it begins
« Reply #9 on: January 08, 2019, 13:21:41 »
Looks like it's a case of "bend over, brace yourself" :angry:

As a firearm certificate and shotgun certificate holder, i'm well versed with this procedure already (metaphorically speaking); criminals manage to get hold of guns illegally and use them for bad things so they make laws tighter for those who buy and use guns entirely legally - go figure  :banghead:

I saw an American slogan recently comparing drug laws to gun laws (which to a Brit is a bit of a joke but the sentiment was the same);

To stop bad people getting guns we need to make them illegal....

Because that works just great with drugs laws.......


I remember seeing grown men cry when their pistols were made illegal and taken away from them with little compensation and even less explanation after Dunblane; good, honest, law abiding people punished for the actions of one idiot. Doesn't this bear a sickening resemblance  :angry:

Offline hoverfly

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Re: And so it begins
« Reply #10 on: January 08, 2019, 13:48:20 »
As a previous possessor of a F.A.C. and shotgun ticket, know the hurdles that have to be gone over to  obtain  them. When the pistol ban came in it wrecked the club I belonged to.
What is not mentioned  in the press is the number of times the Dunblane club contacted the police over their concerns about his fitness to hold a ticket, the police did f/a.
I don't know anybody who was given sufficient compensation or on time when they surrendered their kit.
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Offline aburn09

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Re: And so it begins
« Reply #11 on: January 08, 2019, 14:12:29 »
Watch "CAA Live Q&A at the UK Drone & Tech Show 2018" on YouTube


A few interesting points that might help some ?

Offline UrbanFPV

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Re: And so it begins
« Reply #12 on: January 08, 2019, 16:57:25 »
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Offline Bad Raven

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Re: And so it begins
« Reply #13 on: January 08, 2019, 17:35:05 »
I have bmfa insurance so am I going to need a licence on top  of that for my 5 inch quads...

The natural inference is that like car insurance, if you don't have the other requirements like a Licence and MOT, then you are not covered. Insurance company checks are it seems to be linked to the registration database. Ergo, not registered if model within the scheme = not insured.

I have not read anything to alter from the original EASA process which was that all UAV were included as it was impossible to separate types of UAV in use, and after all, ANY might be used illegally. The first big prosecution in the UK was to a fixed wing pilot!

AFAIK it is you that needs registration if you have any UAV over the weight stated.

Amusingly a while ago I came upon a couple of Trad Modellers indicating that they thought they would be OK and would be completely free and outside the scheme as they fly "free flight".

I asked them if they thought it was likely that a risk where someone HAS control possibility was going to be considered a higher risk than someone who just releases their UAV to the elements with NO control after launch possible? They went white and changed the subject!  ::)




Online ched999uk

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Re: And so it begins
« Reply #14 on: January 08, 2019, 17:39:23 »
FYI:

This is the actual response to the government consultation (without media BS):

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/769128/future-of-drones-in-uk-consultation-response-web.pdf
Interesting document. I wonder how much change will happen before it is passed?

Looks like under 250gms can fly within the 5km airport exclusion zone!!!
PLUS
2.28.
Members of:
─ The Society of Model Aeronautical Engineers trading as the British Model
Flying Association (BMFA);
─ The Scottish Aeromodellers Association (SAA);
─ The Large Model Association (LMA); and
─ FPV UK
Members of the above list of associations are exempt from the requirement to
ensure that direct unaided visual contact is maintained with the aircraft provided
the SUA does not exceed 3.5kg, at heights lower than 1000ft and that first person
view is maintained
. A full list of additional conditions can be found at
https://bmfa.org/DesktopModules/Bring2mind/DMX/Download.aspx?Command=C
ore_Download&EntryId=2644&language=en-GB&PortalId=0&TabId=1506.

Interesting....

Offline Bad Raven

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Re: And so it begins
« Reply #15 on: January 08, 2019, 17:54:56 »
Heathrow Airport closed due "drone sighting".