Cleanflight not enabling different modes

[Cheredanine]

Ok so some basics, mode is a software thing, not an FC hardware thing,
You are clearly enabling modes correctly so let';s rule that out

In a self level mode the FC reads the input from the gyro and acc and corrects its signals to the motors to keep you level.

Hence in angle or horizon mode, with gentle use off the throttle the quad should raise off the floor and pretty much stay where it is. It may drift a little, particularly due to prop wash, centre of gravity being off or the FC not being in the centre of rotation.
(Assume the quad is balanced with the FC at the cog?)

Most 250 pilots don';t use mag or baro, (I don';t have them set on any of my quads and for the latest releases of betaflight mag, baro and acc are usually disabled to get higher loop times.


Soooo
First question is "is the FC reading the gyro ok?
To check this I would connect the quad to clean flight and on a flat level surface with props off, apply the flight battery and just watch to see what the mag is doing.
It should just stay there as the quad isn';t moving.
You can then slowly move the quad and watch that the gyro readout in cf moves smoothly

So assuming the FC is reading its sensors ok, the other potential problem is the quad doesn';t respond to the signal from the FC, this could be any number of reasons:
Props not balanced
Motors not balanced,
Screws holding motors to frame too long and shorting or physically rubbing on motor
Bad solder joints
Bad ESC settings
A short somewhere

All the above I have encountered.

Now the fact your motor physically stops suggests the problem is in this area rather than the FC.

[Limey10]

(Assume the quad is balanced with the FC at the cog?)

... Yep, it';s bang in the middle

Soooo
First question is "is the FC reading the gyro ok?
To check this I would connect the quad to clean flight and on a flat level surface with props off, apply the flight battery and just watch to see what the mag is doing.
It should just stay there as the quad isn';t moving.
You can then slowly move the quad and watch that the gyro readout in cf moves smoothly

... It was rock solid when steady and moved smoothly when rotated by hand. I also noticed that it was attracted to my mobile phone when placed nearby.

So assuming the FC is reading its sensors ok, the other potential problem is the quad doesn';t respond to the signal from the FC, this could be any number of reasons:
Props not balanced
Motors not balanced,
Screws holding motors to frame too long and shorting or physically rubbing on motor
Bad solder joints
Bad ESC settings
A short somewhere

... I';m certainly not discounting any of the above; but because nothing else has changed other than the fc, could it be a duff fc?

[Cheredanine]

It is possible, although we ruled out some of that when you just tested in cf as it sounds like the FC is reading the gyro properly

[Limey10]

Very interesting test flight this morning.

Horizon mode (without Baro or Mag); got to the hover without too much incident (still using lots of inputs to maintain position and a slight amount of drift in yaw). Switched to horizon with Baro, then with Baro and Mag. Absolutely no difference. At no time did it resemble the description of "with gentle use off throttle the quad should raise off the floor and pretty much stay where it is" :-(

Next, Angle... as soon as I lifted off the quad went into a Dutch roll. Like each motor was taking it in turns to throttle up then down, which lead to a crazy oscillation. Managed to set it down before it became expensive.

I will try to video it tomorrow. 

[lamprosGR]

If you running cleanflight 1.11 or above downgrade to 1.10. It s a common problem. We should wait until they fix it. I dont know why the dont call it beta firmware or something so people can know. Good luck

[Limey10]

Hi

I was running 1.11, so I have downgraded to 1.10.

So this is where I am at right now, and it';s not a good place....

I downgraded to 1.10. Connected, went in to setup everything again. I thought, i';ll recalibrate the ESCs. So in cleanflight, throttle to max, connect power to the quad, and all I got was a continuous bleep (none of the pretty music as before). So they won';t calibrate.

Quit out of there. Connected power, raised transmitter throttle, and motors 1, 3 and 4 started around 1020, but motor 2 wouldn';t start until around 1056. So I switched the motors around and the problem stayed with channel 2, and not the motor/ESC.

To satisfy my curiosity, I switched from the FLIP32 back to my old CC3D fc. Power/transmitter on, throttle up, and all motors started exactly together.

The Flip32 is not in the bin yet, but it is getting that much closer....

Forum members, it';s over to you.

Phil

[Cheredanine]

Ok a few bits, confirmed by Borisb himself, min throttle should be set to 10 points past the point when all your motors spin up.
So if it was all sweet and your motors all spun up at 1020 like they do on my latest pet, then min throttle should be set to 1030. However that don';t help you much right now.

When you say you switched motors around do you mean you switched motors or ESCs and motors?
If you just switched your motors then it is possible that ESC has a problem, hw or software.

You also said you raised the transmitter throttle, did you mean this or did you use the motors tab in cf? If the former please repeat using the motors tab, that would confirm the issue is not with the tx, RX or wiring between the two

[Limey10]

Ok a few bits, confirmed by Borisb himself, min throttle should be set to 10 points past the point when all your motors spin up.
So if it was all sweet and your motors all spun up at 1020 like they do on my latest pet, then min throttle should be set to 1030. However that don';t help you much right now.

When you say you switched motors around do you mean you switched motors or ESCs and motors?
If you just switched your motors then it is possible that ESC has a problem, hw or software.

You also said you raised the transmitter throttle, did you mean this or did you use the motors tab in cf? If the former please repeat using the motors tab, that would confirm the issue is not with the tx, RX or wiring between the two

Hi

I moved ESCs and motors together by changing their positions on the fc. The throttle was moved both on the transmitter and in cleanflight using both the master toggle and individual motors.

Hope this helps :-)

[Cheredanine]

Hi

I moved ESCs and motors together by changing their positions on the fc. The throttle was moved both on the transmitter and in cleanflight using both the master toggle and individual motors.

Hope this helps :-)

In some ways no it doesn';t, it others yes it does.

So you are saying regardless of which ESC/motor pair you put on motor2 position when you use the individual motor slider in clean flight motor 2 does not start until way higher than any of the other positions?

If so then:
1. Cf is sending the signal, you can be pretty certain of that
2. And this is my best gues: one of your motor mount screws is too long, (I a, guessing this is why it has moved from motor 3 to motor 2) - unscrew the motor from the frame, hold it very carefully by its cables and using the individual slider in cf see what speed it spins up at
3. If that is not the answer then you are looking at pins and solder joints, probably where the signal connects to the FC
4. Only other thing it could be is damaged component on the board but VERY dubious, would tend to work or not work, not operate at a higher signal

Ps setting min throttle to somewhere around 1079 to 1100 will probably mean the quad flies fine, but you are masking a problem that will throw you out the air and cause damage at some point

[Limey10]

In some ways no it doesn';t, it others yes it does.

So you are saying regardless of which ESC/motor pair you put on motor2 position when you use the individual motor slider in clean flight motor 2 does not start until way higher than any of the other positions?

If so then:
1. Cf is sending the signal, you can be pretty certain of that
2. And this is my best gues: one of your motor mount screws is too long, (I a, guessing this is why it has moved from motor 3 to motor 2) - unscrew the motor from the frame, hold it very carefully by its cables and using the individual slider in cf see what speed it spins up at
3. If that is not the answer then you are looking at pins and solder joints, probably where the signal connects to the FC
4. Only other thing it could be is damaged component on the board but VERY dubious, would tend to work or not work, not operate at a higher signal

I';m not sure that really makes sense to me. I';m not physically unscrewing motors, i';m just moving wires; so that any motor that is hooked up to channel 2 behaves in the same way. Plus, if it was an extra long screw in one of the motors, surely it wouldn';t run properly with the cc3d fc either.

My thought is that of all the variables involved, the fc running with cleanflight is the one that doesn';t work; since the cc3d fc is setup using openflight and appears to work fine with all motors, ESCs, receiver, wiring, soldered joints etc.

For whatever reason, cleanflight doesn';t want to setup the Flip32 fc correctly. Does that make sense?

[Cheredanine]

My bad, I assumed you phyepsically moved stuff.
Ok we have got somewhere.
We have proved the ESC and motors are fine. When you use the motor slider you are really eliminating the processor and the software, the only remaining possible issue is the connection of signal pin 2 to the board, it has to be bad, either a bad solder or a fault on the board where the pad isn';t connected to the trace properly.

The reason is suspect the cc3d doesn';t have the problem is its min throttle will be excessively high. As above, if you set your min throttle to a point above where all 4 props are spinning, it will fly. But fundamentally you have an issue. (I would expect that motor to always have a problem, the FC will compensate but it is never going to be ideal with the issue