F550 just finished. Flips front to rear on take off

[ricfrench]

As above really.
Set up is

Naza M V2 with gps.
Sunny sky 2212 1400';s
9" props
30A simonK firmware ESC';s(one of which was faulty, but replaced)
Flysky TH9X.

Only done initial config as I';m not sure what all the different settings are yet.
I';ve gone through naza assistant and calibrated everything and done the compas/gps naza dance.

Help please

[apollo7]

Are all the props correct orientation and motors spinning correct way round

[Revs]

More often than not, that is caused be either having the motor and/or prop direction wrong (as suggested), the ESCs connected to the flight controller incorrectly or the flight controller orientation is set wrong.

[ricfrench]

Yeah, all motors and props correct and all arrows pointing forward.
It';s almost as though it';s set up with the CoG what too far forward, yesterday I did manage to get it in the air with counteracting elevator then in the air it';s ok, it settles down. It does drift and wander a bit, but I was doing the age old no no and giving it its maiden in the back garden on a windy day. That was set up with settings from a YouTube video, so this morning I thought I';d re-calibrate and restore factory settings, it flipped again but so much faster, it was upside down chewing props before I could do anything.
I';ll try reversing the x and y values, see what happens.

[ricfrench]

No change.

[Revs]

You wanna post up a few pics incase we can spot something you may have overlooked

[rsmith21]

What values do you have entered for the GPS, and , do not try to take off in GPS mode that was what happened when I first took off my latest Naza build, switching to Atti solved it.

Bob

[ricfrench]

Ta Bob, I';ll try that.
I';ll try to get some pics together tomorrow, should have thought of that earlier, completely deconstructed it and put it back together just to double check it.
I have noticed a few threads around(Google search, results from plenty of other forums) that sunnysky motors have a lot of varying quality fakes on the market, sold from the likes of large off shore web sites, which is where I got them from. I';ve noticed, on motor test, that one motor on the front(#1 I think) spins faster and more powerfully than almost all the others, I';ll have a swap around just to check it is motors or possibly ESC';s and not the naza

[rsmith21]

I found that entering the values for the GPS was a little confusing, if the GPS module is above the NAZA then the value is a minus value, I suppose they are saying the controller is lower than the GPS unit and again depending on what side of centre it could be a minus value.

I hope you get it solved.

Bob

[ricfrench]

On the assistant it does tell you how to enter the values, red line + values green line - values. I';ve found I can almost trim it out on the tx. Unfortunately I trashed one prop completely and significantly shortened two others, so to be realistic there';s no way I';m going to get a good result until I get some new ones,
Which is annoying👍👍
🍺🍺some of these instead now😂

[ricfrench]

I have a feeling I';ve ended up with two good motors and 4 duffers.
The ESC';s are doing thier job, the naza is doing its job cos if I take off the props and move the hex around with 50% power all the motors power up and down but they all sound different, there';s no consistancy.
I have a feeling this is where my issue lies

[jamesb72]

Have you calibrated escs 1000-2000, you have to do this first as naza setup doesn';t need this as dji escs come precalibrated. You are best to do this with a 6 way harness and a servo tester showing pulse width so you can do all at once, obviously with props off!

[Allen Williams]

as you have had it in the air that rules out motors/props/esc';s wrong way!

Silly question but is in in manual as opposed to atti or GPS?

[ricfrench]

I haven';t James, no. Nobody has said anything about calibrating ESC';s. How the hell do you do that then????
I';m running 30A simonK firmware ESC';s, I thought that was all sorted with simonK firmware

[rsmith21]

I haven';t James, no. Nobody has said anything about calibrating ESC';s. How the hell do you do that then????
I';m running 30A simonK firmware ESC';s, I thought that was all sorted with simonK firmware

Best to do a search on calibration, I did mine by connecting each ESC ( one at a time though I believe you can make a harness to do them all ) to the Throttle output directly on the receiver, you go through a few steps and listening to the beeps while the stick is moved from full to minimum. I cant recall the exact sequence so that';s why I suggest a search, but it was quite easy.
Then each ESC applies the correct pulse width for a given stick position over all ESCs

Have a look at this http://www.dronetrest.com/t/esc-calibration-guide/851

[ricfrench]

Thanks, that looks like tomorrow mornings job.👍👍👍

[jamesb72]

I haven';t James, no. Nobody has said anything about calibrating ESC';s. How the hell do you do that then????
I';m running 30A simonK firmware ESC';s, I thought that was all sorted with simonK firmware

You calibrate ESC by powering ESC up with full throttle input already present, so you need to split battery feed so you can plug in receiver/servo tester first so they are running, then once that is at 2000ms/high throttle you power up ESCs they will beep to enter calibration, then drop to 1000ms/low throttle, wait for beeps as they set low position, and your done.

Best way to accurately calibrate esc would either be with a servo tester showing pulse width or something like a taranis where you can set atv by pulse width and use throttle output on receiver to calibrate ESC';s, as the Naza is setup for 1000ms-2000ms throttle output (and cannot adjust this on Naza as you can with most other FCs, as DJI expect you to buy their ESC';s which are also pre-calibrated to match), so you need to calibrate non-DJI ESC';s reasonably close to that, then they will fly perfectly.

Calibrating all at once is far easier to do in 20seconds and you can be certain all ESCs match perfectly, better to spend a few minutes soldering up a harness once, than spending ages calibrating and re calibrating ESCs and breaking props/losing your temper. Any variation between ESCs will make tuning impossible so you can lose weeks on faffing around which just isn';t good.

Servo tester I';d recommend is the posh Turnigy one in video at 2m55s, which has specific mode for 1000-2000 output which is ideal for super easy Naza ESC calibration, so you won';t regret throwing a few quid at this, and its a tool for life!

Quicktip servo tester demo - multirotor naza esc ...: https://youtu.be/FRUGUe3b4Z0

If you don';t have the gear to do this, get it ordered and find someone local to get this hex flying anyone competent will have all this stuff :-)

Turnigy servo tester is this one, a really useful bit of kit for loads of other stuff too:

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__77629__Turnigy_Digital_Anolog_Servo_Tester_EU_Warehouse_.html

I use the 5 way harness as I';ve only been building quads, but you could either use two of them daisy chained to plug all 6 ESC';s in together, or a Y lead if you have one (or make one ) to do the hex ESC';s all at once - If your ESC';s have UBEC then remove the red wire from servo plugs before doing this, you don';t need this for Naza as its powered from the PMU:

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__29284__Servo_Splitter_Lead_1_Female_to_5_male.html

[Fletch]

As you haven';t done it before ... Just use your receiver!

Power your receiver from another source other than your quad.
(An old ESC or the broken one on a second battery, as long as the 5v supply works it';ll be fine! 
I actually have an old knackered ESC with the motor wires removed and an xt60 on the supply wires to use as a 5v supply whenever I need separate 5v )

Put your throttle stick at full throttle

Plug the ESC signal wire into the throttle channel in your receiver.

Power up your ESC
(doesn';t matter if you power up your whole hex ... You';ll just have to ignore the other 5 ESC beeps)

Wait for beeps to finish

Pull throttle to zero

Wait for beeps to finish

Power down ESC

Reset and do the next 5!

[rsmith21]

Jamesb72 , said "If your ESC';s have UBEC then remove the red wire from servo plugs before doing this, you don';t need this for Naza as its powered from the PMU:"

James, can you tell me what happens if you don';t do that, I';m not sure if my ESCs have a UBEC or not

[Fletch]

Read the naza manual ...

But as it is powered by its own pmu unit it might not be a bad idea to remove all the positive wires

Which escs are they?

[rsmith21]

Plush 20s with BLHELI

Just read all this thread, http://www.multi-rotor.co.uk/index.php?topic=6779.0  it looks like some say do others say don';t, but this is off topic for this thread so apologies, lets get back to the subject .

EDIT: I have now removed the red wires from the ESC Plugs and run a bench test with props off and it looks the same, hopefully safer :)

[jamesb72]

"If your ESC';s have UBEC then remove the red wire from servo plugs before doing this, you don';t need this for Naza as its powered from the PMU:"
James, can you tell me what happens if you don';t do that, I';m not sure if my ESCs have a UBEC or not

Probably nothing, if your ESC';s don';t have a UBEC the red wire isn';t connected to anything anyway, however if ESC';s have a UBEC they will put out somewhere between 5-6v on the red wire, on a normal RC plane this would power the receiver and servos, however if you have a separate UBEC on the aircraft (the Naza PMU does this, it takes flight pack voltage and outputs 5-6v to power itself and your RC receiver) that will be generating somewhere between 5-6v also.

Either the PMU or the Esc';S will all be generating slightly different voltages (due to manufacturing tolerance or design), as you have multiple ESC';s, they will all have some variation, so connecting them all together say 5.1v to 5.3v to 5.2v they will all be trying to push the other voltage up or down, which generates heat and load on the ESC';s, best case they just get a bit warmer than they should, worst case one or more of them will fail, when this happens worst case that ESC will stop that motor, or the PMU would fail cutting power to the Naza so your multirotor becomes a brick.

Some people say not to worry, I just pinch out the red wires and wrap them in heatshrink or tape, just in case you need them later, so I don';t have to think about it going wrong.

For Naza remove the red wires from all the ESC servo plugs, for other flight controllers you can use one ESC to power the flight controller/receiver, and pinch out the red wires on the others just to be safe.

[ricfrench]

Ok, all 6 ESC';s calibrated following instructions from YouTube, they now all appear to be singing the same tune.
Unfortunately can';t test it properly yet as I';ve had to order some new props, and it';s blowing a hooley outside.

I';m new to this, did a load of research before buying and building, nowhere have I seen it mentioned about the need to calibrate ESC';s. Defo one to remember!!!

[jamesb72]

...did a load of research before buying and building, nowhere have I seen it mentioned about the need to calibrate ESC';s. Defo one to remember!!!

With most flight controllers calibrating ESCs is part of the setup process, ie Naze32 or KK2 have features for this, and you will see this as part of the setup sequence.

DJI is a special case, as they intend you to run their full setup ie Naza FC with DJI ESC/motors, in which case calibrating DJI ESC';s wouldn';t be required - they come pre-calibrated to match the FC 1000ms-2000ms range.

This becomes an issue if you run non-DJI ESC';s with Naza FC, which work fine (assuming decent firmware, simonk is fine) once they are calibrated correctly to match the 1000-2000ms the Naza outputs.

[ricfrench]

It';s also good to know about the KK2 James. My son (12year old) is building a 450 (when all the bits turn up!!) with aKK2.1.5 FC, so I';m sure there will be more qestions regarding that when we get to it👍👍

[ricfrench]

Quick update.
Just got the new props. Put them on, done exactly what I knew I shouldn';t, and fired the beast up in the garden, in the strong wind, at night.
Guess what?






It flies brilliantly. 24mph wind and it flies. The wind made it wander a bit but naza corrected it and put it back.

Thanks for the help.
Next time someone else has the same issue, first thing is calibrate ESC';s!!!!!!

[guest325]

And i';m willing to bet that your face was like a Cheshire cat ::)

[rsmith21]

Quick update.
Just got the new props. Put them on, done exactly what I knew I shouldn';t, and fired the beast up in the garden, in the strong wind, at night.
Guess what?


Great 



It flies brilliantly. 24mph wind and it flies. The wind made it wander a bit but naza corrected it and put it back.

Thanks for the help.
Next time someone else has the same issue, first thing is calibrate ESC';s!!!!!!

[Hairydog]

I made this to calibrate my ESC';s.
I can calibrate 8 at a time.